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00:00President Trump called you and said I really need you to come in and help the country. What would you say. I'm really happy to be doing what I'm doing now. You negotiated with the North Koreans. When I first heard that the president had on the spot accepted Kim Jong un's invitation. I thought oh my goodness what was he doing. Then I thought you know nothing else has worked so fine out on the Iranian agreement. I did not support that agreement. Let's talk about Vladimir Putin. I know him well. He liked me. What are the qualities that you think great leaders actually have a sense of humility about what they can achieve. Would you fix your tie please. People wouldn't recognize me if my tie was fixed but it just seemed to me all right . I don't consider myself a journalist and nobody else would consider myself a journalist. I began to take on a life of being an interviewer even though I have a day job of running a private equity firm. How do you define leadership. What is it that makes somebody tick . President Trump called you and said I really need you to come in and help your country. What would you say. I would say Mr. President there are so many wonderful people who can help our country. And here's my number in Palo Alto. And do give me a call if there's anything you want to talk about. All right but I'm really really happy. From time to time your name has been mentioned as a vice presidential candidate and a presidential candidate. And can you say for sure that you're not likely to run for. I can say that with even more certainty because you have to know your DNA and I don't have the DNA of a politician . I love policy don't love politics. It is just innovating for me . You grew up initially in Birmingham Alabama in a segregated South and some of your friends were in the terrible Birmingham Alabama church bombing. Did you ever think that from a segregated south beginning that you would ever rise up to help these kind of positions that you held. Never occurred to me but more because I thought I was going to rise up and be a great concert pianist. I know but my parents were people who had me convinced that even if I couldn't have a hamburger Woolworth's lunch counter I could be president of the United States if I wanted to be. So I in my family you were going to achieve. You were going to go to college. David I'm not even the first H D in my family. You're your father ahead of you. My father and my aunt Teresa my father's sister and I always say if you think what I do is kind of weird for a black person she wrote books on Dickens of all things. So you were an only child. I was an only child. So your parents obviously focused a lot on you . Yeah definitely. And you had all the lessons that you can have . You were a ballerina at every lesson known to humankind some of which I was good at and some of which I wasn't. But they kept me going. I had French lessons my mother decided that every well-bred young girl should speak French so at nine years old I was dragged off to French lessons on Saturdays. I had ballet lessons. We had etiquette lessons. I was of course a pianist. So yeah. My parents kept me very very busy. Now your mother was a schoolteacher. My mother was a teacher and also a musician as of her students I understand was Willie Mays. My mom taught Willie Mays in Ohio. Was she a good student or. I asked him once he said Oh I was Miss Ray he said she told me Now son you're gonna be a ballplayer. So if you need to leave a little early you go ahead and do that. And I thought doesn't sound exactly like my mother but that's a great story. So I'm going to get onto it now. Your father was a Republican. Yes he was in the early 50s in in Birmingham in Alabama. There weren't many Democrat many Republicans. So the way that it happened was my father and my mother before they were married went down to register to vote and the poll tester looked at my father big tall Van football player and said So how many beans are in this jar and of course my father couldn't answer the question. So he said you don't pass the test. So my father went back to his church and he asked is this he was telling this story to a man who was one of his elders. And Mr. Hunter said all Reverend Don't worry about. He said I'll tell you how to get registered . He said You go down there and there's a clerk who's a Republican. He said now she's trying to build the Republican Party. And if you'll just say you're a Republican she'll register you. So my father went down and he said he was a Republican. He got registered he never forgot it. He remained a Republican the rest of his life. You took up piano when you were 15. I. When I was 3 3. Yes. Right. The great advantage to learning to play that early is that I could read music before I could read. It was like a native language. And so I've always been a really good site reader because it's just natural for me to read the notes you've played with Yo-Yo Ma. What is that like. I was national security adviser and my secretary came in and said Yo-Yo Ma is on the phone for you. I said You mean the greatest living cellist and she said yes. And he was getting the National Medal of the arts and he wanted me to play with him. And so we played for twenty five hundred people at Constitution Hall and it was wonderful. One of the highlights of my life. But I wasn't confused. I didn't play with Yo-Yo Ma because I was the world's greatest pianist. I played with Yo-Yo Ma because I was the national security adviser who could play the piano. So it came together when he held up but he held up his end of the bargain. Yes. You went to university Denver and when you went there Madeleine Albright's father who'd been a very famous international political scientist was your father . He was the one who got me into into international politics actually went to do you as a piano major but graduated with just enough units to be a political science major if you look at my transcript. I've got 100 hundred units of music and forty five in political science. All right. So you then went to Notre Dame to get a masters and then you went to Stanford. Later I went to Stanford on a one year fellowship the arms control and disarmament program learning the physics of nuclear weapons and how many warheads could dance on the head of an SS 18. I learned something very important from that experience. Stanford was looking to diversify its faculty and it engaged in what I think is a very smart way to do affirmative action and to this day I believe affirmative action is still necessary which means you look outside of your normal channels to find people they had in their midst a young black woman was a Soviet specialist and they offered me a job. They said very very firmly when it comes time for your reappointment which is after three years the fact that you came through this appointment will mean nothing at all . I remember saying Oh three years. That sounds about right . That'll give me time to see if I like you and time to see if you like me which I don't think a dean at Stanford had ever heard from a prospective system Erik Schatzker was that you were a classical music performer as well. They had none of those as well especially in political science. What would you say is the chances that North Korea and the United States and South Korea can come to some agreement with the president. I first heard that the president had on the spot accepted Kim Jong un's invitation. I thought oh my goodness what was he doing. And then I thought you know nothing else has worked so why not why not give it a try you were recruited to come to the George Herbert Walker Bush White House operation right. I went to the White House Soviet specialist and got lucky enough to be the White House Soviet specialist at the end of the Cold War. So you were there when the Berlin Wall I went down. And did you go into the president say let's jump up and down and I. I was one of the people the minute that the Berlin Wall fell a bunch of us went over to the Oval Office Mr. President you have to go to Berlin. You have to go for Kennedy. You have to go for Truman. You have to go for Reagan. And he looked at us and he said What would I do dance on the wall. He said this is a German moment not an American moment and I'll never forget that because it was just so much George H.W. Bush self-effacing modest a great sense of humility . And it was the right thing. He was absolutely right. You saw him recently you were at the Barbara Bush funeral and did you have a chance to talk to him. I did. I did. I had a chance to talk to him and and tell him how much I loved him and loved Mrs. Bush. They that's a generation that's going to be missed. They were people who understood kindness and humility and gentility . They made their mistakes small certainly. But when you think about that family and what George H.W. Bush did as a public servant it makes you think of a wonderful time for our country . Bill Clinton came along and in the 1992 election he defeated your board. Were you shocked by the outcome. I was had already gone back to school. I became provost. I was surprised but he had done what he needed to do. And I don't think there will ever be a full accounting of how much it was the way that he did the diplomacy at the end of the Cold War. With respect for Gorbachev never humiliating the Soviet Union not dancing on the wall. One of the last things Gorbachev did before he went out to sign the paper that would collapse the Soviet Union and allowed poor Shelton to become president of Russian Federation he called George H.W. Bush and he said We did good things didn't we. History will judge as well. And I said to President Bush do you realize how extraordinary this is. Well he was George W. Bush said well I never thought about it. I said that the president of the Soviet Union in his last act before the collapse the Soviet Union called the American president essentially to seek his affirmation. That was a very big deal . But that's the way he was. Another member of the George Herbert Walker Bush family decides to run for President George W. Bush . Yes become a necessary adviser the first woman to be an expert adviser. Yes. So you're there and then 9/11 happened. Yes . So where were you on 9/11 9/11. I was at my desk. You'll remember that President Bush was actually at that event in Florida. The education event. And just to show you our pre 9/11 thinking I did not go with him that day my assistant came and said A plane hit the World Trade Center. First we thought it was an accident. I called President Bush. Then a few minutes later we learned the second plane hit the World Trade Center. We knew now it was a terrorist attack. And then just a procession over the day and really the next several months of just Hobson's choice stuff for Hobson's choice after Hobson's choice for the president the United States the United States had not been attacked on its own territory since the war of 1812. We had no structures no institutions for internal security for the country. It was flying without without a compass. Subsequently President Bush decided to invade Iraq to topple Saddam Hussein. So in light of hindsight and had you known there were no weapons of mass destruction would you have still going forward. Well you know I always say to people what you know today can affect what you do tomorrow but not what you did yesterday. And we simply believed as all the intelligence agencies around the world did that he had weapons of mass destruction that he was reconstituting them that he was doing it quickly and it was on that basis that we decided that you finally had to do what the international community had been threatening to do which was to have serious consequences . In retrospect I don't know if we had known what we would have done. I will say this I still think the world's better off without Saddam Hussein. He was a cancer in the region. And while Iraq went through an extraordinarily difficult time. And the thing I would do differently is how we built rebuilt Iraq . I think we made a lot of mistakes post-war. But I will say this . I would rather be Iraqi than Syrian today. And Iraq has a chance now to be a stabilizing element of the new Middle East because they have an accountable government. The Iraqi Kurds and Baghdad are finally finding some way of dealing with one another and it's a very different place. And the Arab Spring was going to happen and I think Iraq would have made Syria look like child's play. So you never know what you prevented . You'll never be able to bring back the lives lost and you'll never be able to deal with the with that. But I think in the long long arc of history Iraq will turn out OK. And I wish we hadn't left in 2011. The one thing that might have made me think differently about it was to think that we would have not stayed with a few troops in Iraq to help them make the transition . President Bush is re-elected to become secretary of state. Yes . So what's it like to go around the world. I loved it. I loved going out and representing the country. Every time I stepped off a plane that said the United States of America behind me I just got chills about it. And I have often said that you know it was a little bit like when you when I was actually sworn in here I took an oath of office to constitution as we've talked that once counted my ancestors as three fifths of a man. And I take that oath of office in front of a portrait of Ben Franklin sworn in by a Jewish woman Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg who was my neighbor at the Watergate and I thought you know what good old Ben think of this right. Because it in some ways it showed how far our country had come. And I always felt when I was out there that I could speak about the hard road to democracy about the importance of institutions becoming more inclusive over time to people who were having those challenges because I personally experienced. Let's talk about today's situation we face a North Korean problem. You negotiated with the North Koreans. What would you say is the chances that North Korea and the United States and South Korea can come to some agreement. Well I have to say when the President I first heard that the president had on the spot accepted Kim Jong un's invitation. I thought oh my goodness what was he doing. And then I thought you know nothing else has worked so why. Why not give it a try. And I actually think they've set the table pretty well. One of the conditions that's different is that once Kim Jong un's programs got to the place that they actually threatened the United States as they have begun to do. I think it got China's attention that the United States might actually go to war to prevent a North Korean leader from being able to threaten the United States. So I think they've got a chance. I would just say three things. The first is the North Koreans have a history of when they're under sanctions and they start to bite coming to the table making promises and then not carrying through with them. So beware . Secondly be very cognizant of other countries interests. You know Japan has big interests here. Don't be very quick to try to think about removing American troops because American troops in Korea on the Korean Peninsula are stabilizing not just to the Korean Peninsula but also to the region. And finally never forget the nature of that regime. I mean this is a regime that murdered an American just a few several months ago reached out and murdered his half brother with Vix gas in Malaysia which by the way was a message to the Chinese. He was under Chinese protection. Word on the street was he was China's favorite son . If something happened to Kim Jong un. So that was a message to the Chinese not to us. Now on the Iranian agreement that was negotiated by John Kerry and Barack Obama did you support that agreement. I did not support that agreement. I felt that it was an agreement that gave the Iranians too much at a time when I think we had the upper hand and could have gotten much more . I also thought the verification means we're very weak. So I wouldn't have signed the agreement but I have said I would have probably stayed in it because once you're in an agreement you don't want to send the signal that the United States just turns its back on agreements that are there but it won't be the end of the world. Let's talk about Vladimir Putin. You've met him . Does he speak English. He he was teaching himself. I had tutors teaching him English and by the time he left office he could converse a little bit in English. But yeah I know him well he liked me. I actually used to because I was a Russian list. I once was with him and he said kind of you know this Russian has only been great when it's been ruled by great men like Peter the Great and Alan started second you think OK. And Vladimir the great is that the message here. But that's what he thinks he is. He thinks he's reuniting the Russian people in greatness and reestablishing Russian influence even if he has to do it by military means which is really the only thing they've got going. You've obviously seen great leaders around the world and the United States. What are the qualities that you think great leaders actually have integrity is at the center of being a great leader once you lose people's trust. You know I think great leaders have a sense of humility about what the Canada chief humility humility versus arrogance versus arrogance arrogance and hubris are recipes for disaster . Talk for a moment about non foreign policy matters. Talk about athletics. You were one of the first two women to be admitted to Augusta National. Was that a surprise to you total surprise . Came it came totally out of the blue when somebody came and offered me membership and I was so stunned I didn't say anything and he said You are gonna say yes aren't you. I said Yeah yeah I mean yes. Were you a golfer or are you a good golf. I'm a golfer. I'm an okay golfer. I started late. I was competitive figure skater as a kid and then a very serious tennis player. I took up golf this summer I was secretary of state. Didn't play very much but I love it and I'm a decent golfer now. Good putter. Now you once said that you wouldn't mind being the NFL commissioner. That's still your aim. I told Roger Goodell who's a good friend of mine I said you know Roger when I was worrying about the Iranians and the Russians every day your job look pretty good. That looks good from Northern California . Now since you left government you've written four books and a new book about the political risk that business people should take into account when they're making business decisions. Why is this an important consideration when people used to think about political risk. They thought largely of the socialist dictator who might expropriate your property or your nationalized here in your industry. Now the sources of political risk are multiple and there's sometimes surprising a person who gets on your airplane and sees your flight attendants treat somebody poorly and has just cell phone and documents in United Airlines. That's political risk. A supply chain that's deep into China. And now there is consideration of a trade war with China. That's a political risk. And so what we wanted to do was to say there are a lot lots of sources of political risk . Look around corners. Look at your industry and say what are my sources of political risk and oh by the way what's my risk appetite. Because we didn't want to say don't do things because they're risky. And by the way cyber is I mentioned the the Russians cyber is a whole category of risk in and of itself. So your point is that businesses when they make decisions significant should take into account political risk and should constantly be surveying the landscape for how those mis risks are multiplying and changing. So as you look back on your extraordinary career what would you like people to think of as your major accomplishment. My government career I just hope that people think that I represented the United States well I hope that people think that I represented our values especially that we stand for people who have no voice for themselves that people who are suffering in jail cells and putting their lives on the line for the very the very rights that we almost start to take for granted. You can say what you think and worship as you please and be free from the knock on the secret police that we advocated for that and we believed that no one of the or should live in tyranny. And my academic career. I I hope that people think that I helped a whole new generation of kids many generations of kids find themselves and recognize that it wasn't ever my job to tell them what to think. It was my job to make sure that they thought in a rigorous and systematic way and that maybe a few leaders that I trained will take that to their leadership. You've obviously seen great leaders around the world and the United States. What are the qualities that you think great leaders actually have and the qualities that people want great leaders fail to have. Well integrity is at the center of being a great leader. Once you lose people's trust you have nothing. I think great leaders are visionaries and I mean by that that they see the world as it should be. Not as it is I think of Nelson Mandela. And I think how sitting in a jail cell for all of those years did he not think well when we finally empower blacks are going to dominate whites rather than thinking of a multiracial multiethnic South Africa that would be for all South Africans. Most importantly I think great leaders have a sense of humility about what they can achieve. Humility humility versus arrogance versus arrogance arrogance and hubris are recipes for disaster. My parents were great people. They always taught me that you need personally to do three things if you're going to lead and if you're going to be successful the first thing is to try to be twice as good. In other words work hard enough to be confident that you've worked hard enough to be twice as good. Secondly and remember I'm growing up in segregated Birmingham Alabama. They were trying to armor me in some ways. Secondly never consider yourself a victim because when you think you're a victim you've given control of your life to somebody else you may not be able to control your circumstances but you can control your response to your circumstances and then something that I tell particularly minority kids and women and others who are from populations that have been in one way or another marginalized. My father once said to me you know if somebody doesn't want to sit next to you because you're black that's fine as long as they move in other words don't take somebody else's prejudice on you . It's their fault. Their problem not your not your problem. And so don't be disabled by people who may have prejudice .

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